GATNDOR Quartely telecon notes

Date: Wednesday, 22. May 2013

Time: 18:00, Europe Summer Time (Berlin, GMT+02:00)

Meeting Number: 702 416 353

Meeting Password: gruan

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Chairing: Fabio Madonna (FM)

Expected on call: John Dykema, Kerstin Ebell, Dian Seidel, Hannes Vogelmann, Alessandro Fassò

Apologies in advance: Greg Bodeker, Peter Thorne (at workshop – sorry), Tom Gardiner (on a field campaign), Dave Whiteman, June Wang

Agenda Items

1. Topic work progress

1.1 Co-location

– Status of the paper on co-location of atmospheric observations (Fassò, Ignaccolo, Madonna, Demoz)

The statistical methods presented in the paper to submit has been also sent by Rosalba Ignaccolo to SIS 2013 Statistical Conference,

Advances in Latent Variables – Methods, Models and Applications, Brescia, June19-21 2013,

and published in the conference proceedings.

1.2 Redundancy

– Status of the paper on quantifying the value of complementary measurements (FM)

Currently the introduction and the description of the approach (based on the use of entropy and mutual correlation) are already done. FM is now using Payerne data and already requested for Lindenberg data (available after June, 6). A draft will be circulated by third week of June.

FM will contact June Wang for the GPS Lindenberg dataset as agreed in De Bilt.

2. Update from TT scheduling

– At the ICM-5 in De Bilt somebody has pointed out the need for a closer cooperation between TT5 and GATNDOR. Since no members from TT3 are attending the telecon, an off line discussion with them will be done and FM will summarize the outcome in the next telecon.

3. Update from SASBE activities

Elaboration of SASBE at two sites from ARM (SGP and Alaska) using sonde, microwave profiler, and also Raman lidar. Lidar data wil be interpolated in time over the sonde sampling time.

Dian Seidel remarks that John Dykema effort has to be coordinated with the analogous with Tony Reale’s activities.

4. GATNDOR new member

– Discuss potential contribution from new members

– Talk given by Hannes Vogelmann: “Measuring Water Vapor with Lidar and FTIR regarding co-location”.available at

The DIAL-FTIR intercomparison study was published here:

Alessandro proposes to collect all the data and the information about the different approaches used for the study co-location on a dedicated “GATNDOR” database. The group will think about this

– Talk given by Kerstin Ebell: “Combining Ground with Satellite Based Measurements in the Atmospheric State Retrieval: Assessment of the Information Content”

The approach and results discussed by Kerstin are reported in a JGR paper under review (minor revision before acceptance) “Combining Ground with Satellite Based Measurements in the Atmospheric State Retrieval:Assessment of the Information Content” by Ebell et al.

John Dykema asks for clarification about RTM models used in the approach. Several models are used depending on the considered observation platforms and the relative operating wavelength. Dian Seidel asks for clarification about how degrees of freedom can be used for representing the information content in the retrievial of an atmospheric parameter. Alessandro Fassò asks for clarification about the method applied and specifically for the covariance matrices used in the optimal estimation method described by Kerstin.

5. PhD funding and call for proposal

5.1 PhD funding

FM asked Xavier Calbet for any possibility to apply for EUMETSAT funds. His answer is reported as follows

<<I have read your proposal. First some comments to your proposal. I  personally believe, although never proven in detail, that the vertical  resolution is not a problem, otherwise the matching of observations and  RTM calculations I am getting would be impossible (  But still it would be interesting to clearly show the vertical  resolution is not a problem (by simulations, etc). What I do find  interesting is assessing the errors statistically (  or the paper you presented at the ICM5). Or even better, what I am  trying to get now is to estimate the particular error you make in a  particular co-location event (one Field of View versus one radiosonde).  We will see how this turns out. There is a recent paper out that seems relevant to the RT calculation to in situ sounding approach by Zhou et al (2013): I do not have access to an electronic version of this paper but I know several of the authors so I’ve emailed them to see if I can get a copy.

Regarding funding. What would suit you best is a figure called  “EUMETSAT fellowships”. For this you have to submit a (very short)  proposal to your nation representatives of EUMETSAT >>

5.2 Proposals

Belay Demoz, FM and Alessandro Fassò have applied for the Funding Opportunity Announced for ASR.

The title of the proposal is “Quantification of value of redundancy for atmospheric thermodynamic ground based observations”.

The pre-application done with a LOI was successfull.B. Demoz is the PI.

Now the group is writing the proposal. The deadline is May, 29.

ARM data have a main role in the prpposal.

It is explicitely mentioned in the proposal that, if selected, the work will be coordinated with   GRUAN and, specifically, with the ARM GRUAN representative (MR. Doug Sissterson).

The project should involve at least two graduate students.

The main objectives of the proposal are listed below.

a Quantification of uncertainty in data profiles from multiple platforms.

a.1 remote sensing and radio sonde

a.2. Sonde-to-sonde comparisons at the same location same time

a.3  Sonde-to-sonde comparisons at different location

b. Application of this techniques to the ARM mobile facility data.

c. To quantify the value of redundant measurements,

c.1 Compare the multi-instrument derived parameters for an accurate assessment of errors.

d. Statistical trend analysis of climatic information after accounting for the error derived from objective.

e. Evaluation and assessment of the overall ARM’s contribution to the overall GRUAN goals.

6. Upcoming conferences

No conferences relevant for GATNDOR/GRUAN in the next quarterly.


7. AOB

8. Adjourn

Next telecon will be in mid October 2013.

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